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Frigidaire/Kenmore Stack Seal/Bearing/Tranny Repair Going Badly 417.97912700


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#1 vgorilla

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 12:34 AM

My washer was leaking and I decided to tackle the project. It also had a loud whine during spin, and frequently was out of balance. I went ahead and ordered a transmission because it was spinning both ways. I installed the following parts:

spin bearing
seal
transmission
belt
idler arm
snubber

After getting it back together, I realize that the transmission shaft is too short by several inches for my agitator. Apparently, my model number pulls up a unit on the sears site that has a shorter agitator. I did not buy the trans from sears, though, and it would be as cheap at this point to buy a new short agitator with nuts and bolts rather than try to exchange my tranny.

So I decided to test it out the new bearings and seal before sinking any more $$ into it. Turns out it still has the high pitched whine during spin. The noise may be coming from the seal area. I hope it put it together correctly. I placed the large accordian-style piece with the spring in it with the small end up. Then I installed the transmission. Then I pushed down the top piece of the seal over the transmission shaft (with the rubber o-ring facing down) and pushed it down until it was snug against the other part of the seal. I did not use any lube here, though I used axel grease on the spin bearing. Also, two springs had a blue stripe and were a litel longer. Those I assembled on either side of the motor. Does this sound right?

Another problem is that, even with the basket empty, it was quickly wobbling like crazy. It might be a little out of level, but I don't want to run it anymore until I know that I've got the seal in correctly. All advice is appreciated. I have attached diagram from sears.

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#2 kdog

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 01:17 AM

I pushed down the top piece of the seal over the transmission shaft (with the rubber o-ring facing down) I used axel grease on the spin bearing.



Oops! prepare to disassemble unit and flip the top part of the seal so that the bronze disc contacts the ceramic face of the boot seal, then work the rubber ring carefully into the centre of the disc, compressing it so it remains tight to the shaft. Do not use any lube on this seal - not a good idea to put grease into the tub bearing either as it will accumulate underneath and "gum up the works". The bushing is oilite so it has oil (not grease) injected in it during manufacture.
As for the springs, the one that doesn't match with the other 2 will have more tension and gets installed 180 degrees from the motor so it offsets the motor weight and aids in balancing - and yes, you can install the other agitator for your style of transmission. Did you use the electrical duplex boxes to extend and hold the springs open during disassembly/assembly ?


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#3 appl.tech.29501

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 07:11 AM

Kdogs on the money!!

and I highly recommend removing the grease that you put on the bearing,
it will shorten its life dramatically.

If you still get the "whining noise" check your water pump for debris.
If wobbling continues check the arms of the tripod...they tend to crack
and brake where they are welded to the base.
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#4 vgorilla

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 08:16 AM

Thanks for the quick responses. I'll flip the piece and get as much grease off as I can. To be clear, this unit has not parts above the trasmission that contain any oil, grease, or bearings. It simply has the bushing that screws to the tub. The seal assembly has no lube in it at all. The reason I greased it is that it looked like grease was on the old assembly. The whining noise has sometihng due to the rotation of the tub. It is high-pitched and with every rotation has a cycle of being a little louder and a little quieter. When I pull the tub I will check closer for any contact.

No, I didn't use electrical boxes, I pulled the springs off with pliers removed the tub. Knuckle beater. I cleaned areas that contacts the snubber with alcohol, though it is still not smooth because the paint is largely gone. There had been a lot of leaking and goo there.

#5 vgorilla

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 10:35 AM

Update:

Disassembled. Looking for contact between the basket and tub. There is an arc of what looks like melted plastic on the bottom of the tub, about 2 in wide by 12 in long. No corresponding mark on the basket, other than one of the holes on the bottom has melting around it. Possible a previous incidence of something being caught between the two?

I want to confirm again that there is no grease or oil whatsoever to be on the shaft anywhere above the top seal of the transmission.

An odd thing, the transmission came with an extra bearing that looks just like the one on the shaft on the bottom of the transmission. The parts diagram does not show a second bearing anywhere nor did I run across one in disassembly.

Please dump all your samauri wisdom on this grasshoppa' before I put this thing back together. My knuckles are starting to look like hamburger from fooling with the springs.



#6 kdog

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 07:32 PM

The reason I greased it is that it looked like grease was on the old assembly.



That's not grease, that's the result of contamination from your failed seal - you may have damaged your tub seal with it upside down - they's kinda tricky to get in there, I set the bronze on first and then gently guide the rubber til its almost there and then apply some good ol' universal lubricant (spit) to the rubber and kinda squeeze it into the groove of the bronze; while at the same time compressing the spring in the lower boot seal.

As for the bearing - open the part link below and you will see the transmission as we get them - the sqare housing at the bottom contains the bearing and its frame bolts to the bottom of milkstool. If you lubed the snubber ring at all - it will shake like a dog shitting razorblades, Be sure that the square block in the trunnion of the basket is tightened strait and squarely on the flat of the shaft.

http://www.repaircli...er=417.97912700

 

01027650.jpg


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#7 appl.tech.29501

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Posted 08 July 2011 - 07:38 PM

would love to see the additional bearing that came with the tranny,
post a pic somewhere and give us the link.

And yes, melted plastic is the result of something getting stuck between the tubs.


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#8 vgorilla

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Posted 10 July 2011 - 10:51 AM

The extra part essentially looks the same as the lower bearing, esentially like this part

I did get the paper saying I need to use the new spline, but that was not included. Maybe they included the incorrect part on mistake. The tub seal appears undamaged. How far down should I compress the lower boot seal? I did not lube the snubber.

About the adjustable springs. Originally, they were all hooked in the second to outside positions. Is there ever a reason for hooking them in a different position?

#9 appl.tech.29501

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Posted 10 July 2011 - 12:24 PM

wow, cant believe they put that part in your box as thats not a part you can purchase from Frigidaire.

the seal just gets compressed far enough the install the threaded block to the tranny shaft.

Not sure why that have those extra adjustments in the base....maybe an initial engineering
idea in the event the outcome of the design wasn;t as expected and maybe the need for in the
field adjument for stability.
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#10 vgorilla

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Posted 11 July 2011 - 08:34 AM

compressed far enough the install the threaded block to the tranny shaft


What threaded block are you referring to? On my unit, I install the seal and then tighten the basket to the shaft. I'm gussing that the seal should press up against the bottom of the basket, but I'm not sure how to determine how much compression that would require. Perhaps the spring in the seal will work its way to where it needs to be?

#11 appl.tech.29501

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Posted 11 July 2011 - 11:24 AM

The trunion part # 16 pushes the seal down until the
top of the trunion is under the "flat Notch" on the tranny
shaft so part # 15 can be installed.

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#12 vgorilla

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Posted 11 July 2011 - 11:35 AM

So if I detach the trunion from the basket and install it first, then I can get a better idea of how far to compress the spring. I was leaving the trunion attached to the basket.



#13 appl.tech.29501

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Posted 11 July 2011 - 03:53 PM

There's really no adjustment to it...just compress until the
threaded bar fits into the the slot on the tranny shaft.

install the tub last.
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#14 kdog

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Posted 11 July 2011 - 03:53 PM

Don't remove the trunnion from basket -just make sure it is lined up squarely with the flat on the shaft, tightening it on the round part of shaft would be VERY bad. If you installed the upper broze disc and rubber seal correctly it will hold itself in position; doesn't need to be compressed too much, but a positive pressure


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#15 vgorilla

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 07:45 AM

I've got the seal installed correctly and it seems to be holding water, and no more high pitched whining. Another question, what's the rule of thumb for how tight to set the drive belt?

#16 kdog

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 10:52 PM

Idler spring pressure provides belt tension second of five grooves if memory serves


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#17 vgorilla

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 11:38 PM

2nd tightest or 2nd loosest setting?

#18 kdog

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 10:17 PM

When the spring in a relaxed position, the second groove - I have moved them up a notch but makes little difference - mfr used that slot, so best to do the same


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#19 vgorilla

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 11:20 PM

Thanks, we're back up and running. Your info has been very helpful.

#20 kdog

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Posted 16 July 2011 - 03:37 PM

Well Done !! That's a real Filthy McNasty of a job - didja take any pics along the way you can post for those who follow ?

:woohoo:


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Recent blog entries on this topic

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Tips for installing a new transmission, tub seal and bearing in a Frigidaire / Kenmore stack laundry top-loading washer

By Samurai Appliance Repair Man in Samurai Appliance Repair Man's Blog, on 10 July 2011 - 01:12 PM

Transmission part link ==> Transmission


Source: Frigidaire/Kenmore Stack Seal/Bearing/Tranny Repair Going Badly 417.97912700

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