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Amana won't agitate in Regular Cycles


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#1 lef

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:33 AM

Amana LWA40AW2 Washer -- The washer will not agitate in all Regular Cycles or Perm. Press Normal.  It does agitate in Perm. Press Light & all Delicate Cycles. 

.

The lid switch is working.  Power supply is OK.  When not functioning there are no sounds [e.g. humming, etc.].  When left in Regular Cycle [& not agitating] the timer advances.  All attempts have been with only a few items of clothing [very light load].

 

I am puzzled since it functions in three of the possible seven agitation cycles.  This, to me, eliminates motor, transmission, belt, lid switch, and power as possible causals.  This leaves only the Timer/circuit board in the system but since it advances even though not functioning I am uncertain if it is the problem.

 

Suggestions will be appreciated.



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#2 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 08:03 AM

  It's not working in high speed motor function during agitation. Does it spin ok in normal cycles? If so, looks like a bad timer. If not, check the blue wire at the motor connector and timer connector. If blue wire connections and continuity check are good, bad timer.

 

http://www.repaircli.../37929P/2191629

 

Eric


Edited by fairbank56, 11 August 2013 - 08:04 AM.


#3 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 11:47 AM

... will not agitate in all Regular Cycles or Perm. Press Normal. 

... It does agitate in Perm. Press Light & all Delicate Cycles. 

... When not functioning there are no sounds [e.g. humming, etc.]. 

 

It could be a bad Timer

OR:

The Regular cycles use the High Speed Motor winding (Blue 7 to White 4)

The Dedicates use the Low Speed (Pink 3 to White 4)

The High Speed Motor Winding could be bad

 

but either way, the Motor would usually make some noise when trying to Start / Run

 

5ksd.jpg


Edited by RegUS_PatOff, 11 August 2013 - 03:42 PM.
thanks fairbank56

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#4 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 11:50 AM

The Low Speed Motor Winding could be bad

 

  Agitation works ok in delicate (low speed)



#5 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 03:37 PM

  Agitation works ok in delicate (low speed)

edited, thanks  :rolleyes:


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#6 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 04:15 PM

  Well, it can't be the high speed winding, otherwise it wouldn't start at all.

 

Eric



#7 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 04:37 PM

  Well, it can't be the high speed winding, otherwise it wouldn't start at all.

hhhmmm ..

if one of the Speed windings didn't work,

wouldn't the Motor try to Start,

(pause / jerk when the Run winding isn't working)

keep trying to Start ?

 

same "jerking" if the Start or Run contacts in the Timer was bad...

(unless both contacts / Cams were bad)


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#8 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 05:01 PM

  There is only one start winding which is for the high speed winding. There is no start winding for the low speed winding which is why the motor always starts in high speed even when low speed is selected. That's what one set of switch contacts is for. When low speed is selected, it starts in high speed via the switch contact but once the motor comes up to speed power is transfered to the low speed winding via the switch which is operated by the centrifugal mechanism in the motor. When high speed is selected, power is direct to the high speed winding. It doesn't go through any switch contacts.

 

  If the low speed winding is open, if low speed was selected, the motor would continuously start/stop due to the centrifugal switch. This would not happen when high speed is selected as it doesn't go through any contacts. If the high speed winding was open, the motor wouldn't attempt to start regardless of speed selected. Power must be applied to both high speed winding and start winding in order for the motor to attempt to start.

 

Eric



#9 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 05:18 PM

The Start winding is used for either Speed.

Yes, for Low Speed, it starts in High (more initial torque)

but the actual Start winding polarity is used to determine direction (Spin / Agitate)


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#10 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 05:32 PM

  It starts in high because the high and low speed run windings are different and there is only a start winding for use with the high speed winding. For example, there are GE washers with two speed motors that have separate start windings for each run winding. Thus no centrifugal switch is required. The point is, the problem is not the motor windings because it runs fine in low speed which means the high winding, low winding and start winding are working and it's not the motor switch because the high power feed (blue wire) does not go through the switch contacts. It does go through the switch terminals but Iv'e never seen one of them break.

 

Eric



#11 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 05:41 PM

The Start winding is used for either Speed.

Yes, for Low Speed, it starts in High (more initial torque)

but the actual Start winding polarity is used to determine direction (Spin / Agitate)

most all Whirlpool (etc) Washers

see PDF pages 122, 123, and Timer Chart on page 124

Timer Contacts for the Start winding (bottom two Cams on chart)

http://appliantology...service-manual/


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#12 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 05:46 PM

  I don't have a clue what point you are trying to get across. I made no mention of direction of rotation. That is not the issue.

 

Eric



#13 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 05:53 PM

the Start winding contacts (bottom two on the chart)

are used during Wash and Spin during all Speed cycles


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#14 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:03 PM

  But what is your point??? The start winding is not used during wash and spin, it is only used, in tandem with the high winding, to start the motor. It is switched out of circuit by the centrifugal switch during wash and spin. The start winding alone, does not start the motor. There must be power applied to both the start winding and high winding in order for the motor to start.

 

Eric



#15 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:06 PM

but the Start winding is also used during the Low Speed (Delicate) Wash cycles


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#16 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:11 PM

  It is not used during low speed operation. When low speed is selected, power is first applied to the start winding and the high speed winding (via motor switch). The motor starts running. The start winding is switched out of circuit and power is transfered to the low speed winding by the motor switch.

 

  Your still not making a point.

 

Eric



#17 RegUS_PatOff

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:17 PM

and if the Motor doesn't "Run" at either Speed selected,

and since the Start winding is "powered" during the entire cycle,

If the Motor pauses OR never "runs"

it'll continuously try re-starting for the entire Wash cycle


also, if it runs in low Speed, (Low Speed winding OK)

it would seem that the High Speed winding is also OK

 

I think we're both right, but looking at it from different pages


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#18 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:33 PM

  The problem with the washer in question is that no power is applied via the blue wire during high speed agitation. There is also no noise from the motor which means the timer is bad. If either winding had power to it, high or start, the motor would hum. Only having power to the start winding will not cause it to try re-starting continuously because power to the start winding alone does not causes motor rotation.

 

  You said the problem could be a bad high winding. That is not correct. If the high winding was bad, the motor would not work in low speed and it is working in low speed.

 

  It seems to me that you are under the impression that the start winding alone make the motor start rotating. It doesn't.

 

Eric


Edited by fairbank56, 11 August 2013 - 06:36 PM.


#19 fairbank56

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Posted 11 August 2013 - 06:55 PM

  For anyone interested in the theory. The motor in question is a single phase squirrel cage induction motor. A rotating magnetic field is required to get the rotor rotating. Single phase power does not provide this so we add another winding, the start winding. The way it is wound (number of turns and wire size) in conjunction with the series capacitor provides a phase shift in the current applied to it with respect to the current applied to the run winding. This creates a rotating magnetic field. Once the rotor is rotating, it creates its own rotating magnetic field and the start winding is no longer required and is switched out of circuit. On this particular motor, the start winding and capacitor are not designed for continuous power and will be damaged if not switched out of circuit after the motor starts or if it doesn't start. Starting direction of rotation is determined by the polarity of current through one winding with respect to the other winding. Reversing polarity of either winding will cause direction of rotation to reverse.

 

Eric



#20 jumptrout

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Posted 12 August 2013 - 06:34 AM

My head hurts.








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