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Before I replace the washer's main board

MV

23 replies to this topic

#1 Ga Vey

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 01:04 PM

Roper  RTW4640YQ0 a single knob VMW.

About 3 years-old.

 

Symptom: Drain Pump will not start

Started cycle and waited. Rinse light went on, drain pump did not start. No clicks heard. It timed out and all lights went out. Ran automatic and manual diagnostic tests. They confirm that drain pump doesn't start.

 

Using J16 pins 2->3 resistance shows 15.6 ohms.

 

Diagnostic Book says to replace main board at ~$300 although I found one here at ~$100.

http://www.usefulpar...w10484681-rev-a

 

Should I pull the pump just in case it is jammed?

 

Anything else I should check?



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#2 Ga Vey

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 04:36 PM

Went ahead and pulled the pump. Impeller is free. All other functions, such as agitate and spin works fine. Of course it won't spin unless I manually start a slow spin manually using the manual diagnostic test.

 

The above link goes to a company in Canada, so I can't use them. I've ordered other things from Canada only to have them get stuck waiting for customs.

 

But there are other places. Some want the old board back. Some claim to sell "refurbished" ones.

 

The "old" board was for sale all over the place for ~$129, but is no longer available. The substitute board sells for over ~$300 -- close to the price of a new basic washer like this one.



#3 LI-NY Tech

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 04:51 PM

Is there voltage to the pump when it's supposed to be running?


David
RD Appliance Service, Corp.

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#4 northeastappliance

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 05:07 PM

I would also check the wires at the connector to the drain pump. Put it in a drain/spin cycle and jiggle the wires around. If the pump goes on and off, i would change the connector. I've seen quite a few wire harness issues with this style machine. I've never replaced a main board. But I would check to make sure you have 120v out of the main board.


Northeast Appliance LLC.

Boonton NJ 07005

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#5 Ga Vey

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 06:51 PM

I thought about power not getting to the pump, but then looking at the book, testing continuity between those two pins requires current to be able to flow through the motor windings  and the shifter assembly. If the wires were loose at either of those places, it would show open. The windings resistance is within normal limits (14-25 ohms).

 

I might put on my safety gloves and give it a voltage test, but I would have to hook up using alligator clips and move fast because I think the manual test only lasts 5 seconds before it times out.

 

At first I thought it was maybe the door safety switch, but then I realized that if it was that, it wouldn't agitate or spin either.

 

Looking at the book again, I found the troubleshooting chart. It says to check the wiring harness, then do the continuity test as I described and then do a control board test which is going to take a long time to do with my alligator clips clipped to paperclips rig.

 

First thing is says is to remove the console and I dunno how to do that. I've removed the back of the console and I see clips holding it down, but there must be another secret handshake I haven't heard of to spring those clips since a putty knife didn't work for me.



#6 northeastappliance

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 07:04 PM

i had a few in the past not draining. all i did was put it in to a drain/spin cycle and nothing happened. it wasn't until i wiggled the wires right at the drain pump connecter that it started drain. thats one of the many wire harness issues I've with these. its real easy to check. its worth a shot.


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#7 LI-NY Tech

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 07:04 PM

Unplug the washer. Get your test leads all set up at the pump. Plug the washer in. Run the pump test. No need for gloves.

David
RD Appliance Service, Corp.

PO Box 234, Bethpage, NY, 11714

516-561-0523

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#8 northeastappliance

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 07:08 PM

if you open the lid you can feel under the front corners of the console. there is a metal clip on both corners. push in on the clip and lift up on the console. it should come up. the other way is to push a putty knife in between the console and the top of the washer(lid area) while puling up on the console


Northeast Appliance LLC.

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#9 Ga Vey

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Posted 17 March 2015 - 07:26 PM

Okay, I'll try these things tomorrow. Thanks for the ideas.



#10 Ga Vey

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Posted 18 March 2015 - 02:50 PM

I ruled out a wiring problem. Here is what I did:

I noticed that the plugs looked like .025 connectors, so I made up some jumpers using M & F crimp on connectors and a 120V cheap extension cord.

 

Plug the pump into the wall and it runs fine. Plug into the pump plug on the harness and there is no voltage when doing the drain pump test. Plug into  J-16 pins 2 and 3 on the board and there is no voltage when doing the drain pump test.

 

Tested the board for 13VDC and it is 12.8 on an uncalibrated meter.

 

I think I can rule out the harness and the pump.



#11 northeastappliance

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Posted 18 March 2015 - 03:30 PM

ok next step i would try is finding where the power comes out of the board. put it into drain spin mode and see if the board itself is sending the power out to the pump. if it is sending power out at the board i would say you have a wiring issue. if not, replace the board.

 

here is the problem with the wiring on these machines. instead of using the standard crimp style connecter, whirlpool decided to cheap out. its hard to explain but i'll do my best. when they make these harnesses, they simply lay the wiring over a metal "V" and when the clamp the connector down to secure it, it pushes the  wire into the "V", thus cutting the insulation so that the metal "V" in the connector makes contact with the metal in the wire. that presents a major issue. they are cutting the wiring to make contact. now you take a washer that spins and shakes combined with wiring that is to thin and what do you get? A wire that is cut completely inside the connector that is not visible. That will drive a tech like me crazy. I've also seen the wiring break inside the insulated coating were the factory zip tie them.

 

I used to be a mechanic. I drag race as much as I can. Back in my younger days (not that I'm old) i used to use that same style connecters in my race car. I was at a big race late in the season(around oct in nj, so it was cold). well i was in the finals and the was a decent amount of $$ on the line. I was having electrical problems with my car. It was doing all sorts of weird shit. I ended up fore fitting because we just couldn't get the car to start and stay running. well it turns out that in the cold weather the wires shrink a bit and lost connection. needless to say the whole car was rewired after that and I've never had that issue again. sorry for the long rant but hopefully you get the point as to why I'm so concerned about the wire harness. good luck and let me know what you find


Northeast Appliance LLC.

Boonton NJ 07005

http://www.northeast...anceservice.com


#12 Ga Vey

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Posted 18 March 2015 - 03:48 PM

"ok next step i would try is finding where the power comes out of the board. put it into drain spin mode and see if the board itself is sending the power out to the pump."

 

Did that with my jumpers. No power coming out of the board from pins 2 & 3 of J-16 block when I put the machine into drain pump test mode.

 

Thanks for explaining the harness situation. They do the same thing with compute network wiring which works okay for a while in a wall, but if it is disturbed at all it needs to be sealed.



#13 LI-NY Tech

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Posted 18 March 2015 - 06:21 PM

Follow the steps in test 7 on your tech sheet. Do them exactly as they are written and in order. That will give you a definitive answer.

David
RD Appliance Service, Corp.

PO Box 234, Bethpage, NY, 11714

516-561-0523

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#14 Ga Vey

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Posted 18 March 2015 - 06:41 PM

Follow the steps in test 7 on your tech sheet. Do them exactly as they are written and in order. That will give you a definitive answer.

 

I did and it did. Ordered the new board tonight.



#15 Ga Vey

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 11:36 AM

It was the board.

Got the board in yesterday afternoon and was washing last night. Sending in the core today.

 

Thanks for the moral support!



#16 northeastappliance

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 03:48 PM

congrats man. sorry to steer you in the wrong direction. I've just seen to many fail in the wire harness (I personally go there 1st). But its fixed now. Thanks for letting us know the culprit.


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#17 Ga Vey

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 05:27 PM

Hey fellas, before I lose you. Now I'm hearing strange sounds. Sounds like plastic gears stripping/slipping? I'll have to pull up a chair and a book and run a cycle to tell you exactly when I hear it, but I think it's when the drain cycle starts.

 

Any idea what that could be?



#18 northeastappliance

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 06:10 PM

check that pulley that bolts to the trans. a lot of times the nut backs off and the pulley strips out. if its loose you can usually see it where into that plastic cover. 


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#19 Patricio

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 10:44 PM

Did you put the machine thru its calibration mode Per manual instruction after installing new board?


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#20 Budget Appliance Repair

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 04:51 AM

If at the start of the drain cycle and tub hasn't really started to try and turn yet, just the pump starting to empty tub of all water before spinning - my bet is on debris/coins in pump or just the pump beginning to wear out and getting a little noise on start up.


William Burk (Willie)
Willie's Budget Appliance Repair
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