SPEED QUEEN WASHER AWS17NW MOTOR PROBLEM

[Guest]

I'm having a terrible run of issues lately.  Our Speed Queen washer which has been a stellar performer for years has shat the sheets.

A few days ago it went to spin and the motor just hummed.  I looked at a parts diagram on Sears Parts Direct and found that it had a capacitor and with limited available time I ordered one to delived the next day for $14. and figured I may get lucky and have that be the issue when I have time to look at it further the next day.

Turn out this model does not use a capacitor and the diagram was for other models.

I pulled the motor out last night hoping I could get to the centrifugal switch and perhaps lubricate the motor shaft and possibly sand the contacts on the switch. Well the motor is sealed as far as I can tell.  I can open the contacts with a screwdrive through the small openings but I don't see being able to do anything useful. I ordered a replacement that won't be here fast enough.  

Just checking to see if anyone has any ideas about how I could get into this motor; it's not clear where it's sealed or how.  I used compressed air to blow everything out and used some electronic cleaner.  Hooked it up and it still hums unless I give it a boost by hand.  

I'm also wondering if adding a capacitor would be a good idea for the new motor?

It's such a waste to scrap the motor when I think it's likely it just needs to be lubricated and or have the contacts cleaned.

 

[citizenX]

Those motors aren't made to be taken apart and serviced. If it will start if you give it a turn by hand then could be a bad start winding or one going bad. Lubricating the motor isn't going to do anything as the bearings are permanently sealed. The motor should turn reasonably freely by hand so unless it's totally unable to be turned by hand I doubt it's a bearing issue, and if it can't be turned by hand due to a seized bearing then there's nothing you can do anyway except replace the motor.  That said, it could also very well be a bad/arced contact in the timer that isn't sending full power down to the motor; I've run into that a lot over the years. It is possible to clean up the arc'd timer contacts but it can be tedious. Not ruling out a bad motor but I've replaced far more timers for this hum/no start issue than I have motors, and I don't think I've ever had a bad centrifugal switch on a speed queen. 

[Guest]

Interesting.  Thank you for your reply.  Yeah the motor turns quite freely but just hums before I give it a little twist by hand. It doesn't take much. My thought on lubrication was that the centrifugal switch has to slide up and down the motor shaft and could be gummed up. 

I even took the drive belt and used it to apply drag to the turning pulley and it wasn't easy to stop. Actually I didn't stop it, it just seems to me like it has plenty of torque; but lacks the startup power.  Maybe you're right about the contacts in the timer. I will take a look. 

When I have the motor out of the machine with the power connector connected it did click on correctly after I blew it out with air and electrical cleaner but I would not start up when attached to machine with the belt on. 

 

[Guest]

6 hours ago, citizenX said:

Not ruling out a bad motor but I've replaced far more timers for this hum/no start issue than I have motors, and I don't think I've ever had a bad centrifugal switch on a speed queen. 

Just back from reinventing the wheel. 

Opened the top and disconnected the harness where it leads down into the cabinet.  Tested 190V. Went down to the motor and disconnected the harness and it tested 119V. Pushed the timer knob in just confirm nothing was getting power with the lid down and the timer pushed in. 

Took the one suspension spring off thats in front of the washer. Took the drain and supply hoses off the pump. Removed the four screws that hold the motor mount to the tub and frame. Removed the motor and pump as one assembly.  Yesterday I had been able to remove the pump without removing the hoses; I just folded it back but the clearance to get it off the motor was maybe a half inch. Released the clips from the pump and removed it. Tried the motor and it was fine. Looked at the pump and turned it with a screwdriver it seemed fine. Remembered I bought a new pump last year just in case this one failed so I got  that and turned it with a screwdriver and it was the same; probably a little harder to rotate actually. Put the old pump on the motor without the clips just to confirm it could turn the pump; it did.  Said WTF in my head. Decided I'd just put the new pump on and put it back together and see what happens.  Works perfectly. 

My theory is either I got lucky and something got knocked loose and it's going to fail again. 

My thought is the old pump when it had the clips on it and perhaps somehow the motor shaft adds some downward weight when all installed was causing the old pump to bind just enough that the motor could not get over the hump to start spinning but would with a slight nudge. 

Thank you for your advice; it got me doing the right tests. 

 

 

 

 

[citizenX]

Well that certainly wouldn't be the first time I've taken something apart and can find nothing wrong, then put it back together and it works! I chalk it up to either loose connections or the appliance gods are just screwing with you! 

Couple things: When doing voltage checks in a hum/no start situation like this it's always best to check under load if possible. You can have good power when it's not under load but it'll typically drop out under load if there's a loose connection issue. Also, I've had plenty of these units that have had a bad upper tub bearing/leaking tub seal and it will just hum and not start because the bearing is seized or starting to. If you do get things to move though, a bad tub bearing will generally sound like a jet taking off as it ramps up speed in spin. An item stuck in the pump or a locked up transmission can also make it hum and not start. When I said to check if the motor turns freely, I assumed that the motor was off the machine and not hooked to the pump. Once the belt is off and the motor is out of the way, you can reach in manually to turn the bottom drive pulley to release the brake to get the transmission and inner basket turning. It'll take a bit to get it moving by hand but it should turn. If there is a clothing item stuck between the inner and outer tubs, that could make it not turn. FYI, the motor turns one way to agitate (brake holds the transmission and inner tub from turning) and it turns the other way to unlock the brake and spin the tub. If it all turns and you see nothing in the pump and the pump turns easily with a screwdriver then I seriously doubt the pump was causing the issue. You can also unplug the the molex connectors from the timer and plug it back in to make sure they are seated securely.  

Hopefully it continues to work for you. If it acts up again and the motor, pump, transmission all turn freely, I'd really suspect the timer first, then the motor. That timer runs over $200 though and that motor is I think 400ish? Like I said earlier you can inspect the timer contacts for excessive arcing/burnt contacts but it can be tedious without bending the contact "arms" to the point it then won't work at all. Fingers crossed! 

[Guest]

Thank you for all of that. All good advice. 

The old pump was certainly louder than the new pump when I tested them out of the machine. The old one sounded as though  the fins were dragging or otherwise just loose.  I'm going to try to crack open the old one somehow to see what there is. 

I had already ordered a used motor on eBay for $75 shipped but won't be here until Monday. So I'll have a spare available.  

The tub did move freely as you described with the motor off.

I will certainly look at cracking into the timer if the issue comes up again. As much as I want to preserve the old style washers and dryers I would still have a hard time spending 400 on a part. 

I have a line on another speed Queen washer and dryer for $100 so that will be good to grab at that price. The SQ washer has been a solid performer for several years until now. 

Thanks again 

[Guest]

On 1/27/2024 at 10:47 AM, citizenX said:

Hopefully it continues to work for you. If it acts up again and the motor, pump, transmission all turn freely, I'd really suspect the timer first, then the motor. That timer runs over $200 though and that motor is I think 400ish? Like I said earlier you can inspect the timer contacts for excessive arcing/burnt contacts but it can be tedious without bending the contact "arms" to the point it then won't work at all. Fingers crossed! 

Three weeks later and the machine is working without any issues. I was able to source another similar Speed Queen Top Load fully manual for $100. which came with a gas Speed Queen dryer as well.  It's a really old one but it's clearly heavy duty.

[evaappliance]

On 1/26/2024 at 4:34 PM, citizenX said:

but I've replaced far more timers for this

He is right , if it does it again I would get a timer .  Not uncommon at all for it to start working again when this happens , sometimes it goes a very long time before doing it again , sometimes it never does it again, it is a quirk it the timer where it puts it into wash and spin at the same time overheating the motor.  Back when these were new and did it I would replace the timer under warranty even if it started back working. Years ago they had a service pointer on this issue.