Kenmore Upright Freezer 253-28459810 - Erratic Temps and Runs Excessively - HELP

[Clark6]

Hi all and thanks in advance for your help.

I have a Kenmore upright freezer model 253-28459810 that was made around 2012 area. It has digital temperature controls with door alarm located on the outside of the door. The parts listed for this Kenmore seems to be Frigidaire parts.

I have been trying to regulate the temperatures to correspond to the digital controls. Also the fan or compressor seems to run excessively. At times it will shut off but can run actually for hours if not longer. While it is running the exterior sides of the freezer become warm to the touch (NOT hot though). The door, top and rear panels are all cool to the touch. When it does shut off the sides are cool to the touch.

Symptoms:

1. Temperatures vary from about 14° to  -10° with the digital controls set and 0°. I tried changing the temps settings with same results. Sometimes it is correct other times I check it is not.
2. The fan seems to run nearly constantly. It does occasionally shut off. I assume this is when the compressor shuts off or the defrost mode is disengaged.
3. The compressor does not seem to have any problems starting. It does not click of fail to start.
4. Checked the interior coils. They are not iced up. All coils at times have light frost on them so do not believe it is a freon problem.
5. Fan runs whether door is open or closed until freezer occasionally shuts off.

What I Have Done:

1. Testing Compressor - Panasonic SHH51C97RAU

Tested each compressor pin for continuity between each other. They test OK. Tested each pin to compressor copper pipe to check for internal short. All tested with no continuity - OK.

2. Testing Relay - Part no. 216954214

What I am NOT sure of is if thermistor controlled relay is working properly under load conditions. What do you think? Could this be causing the problems? Is the compressor not shutting off correctly due to the thermistor and keeps running and running?

Compressor has 3 pins that a relay module plugs into, triangular in shape. The relay has a capacitor that plugs into that. The relay has a double wire that plugs into it. The relay also has an overload protector built in.

It tests OK for continuity on bottom 2 pins. This circuit runs through a thermistor. So when at room temperature the thermistor appears to be working?

No continuity to pin hole at top that connects through overload to power. The top pin of the triangle is connected to the overload that a plug that the double wire plugs into. There is continuity on this so it appears the overload is intact and working.

3. Tested Relay Capacitor - Part no. 216985001

Black box capacitor that plugs into relay. Rated at 15uF. Tested capacitance with digital multimeter. Read out at 15.20. Assume capacitor is OK.

4. Thermistor Temperature Regulator - Part no. 297018400

This is located inside freezer compartment. A small double wire piece that screws into back wall of freezer near fan. I assume this is like a thermostat and determines temperature to digital controls.

I cut the wires to this and replaced it with a new one of same part number of different manufacturer. This produced no different results.

5. Defrost Heater - Part no. 5304496687

I replaced this with a new element and thermostat. I could not test the old one in place and the thermostat on it was permanently attached. The new thermostat is removable from the element. I thought possibly the thermostat on this might be bad and keeping the defrost cycle going constantly.

This produced no different results.

6. Digital Controls On Door - Frigidaire Part no. 297366201

After testing/replacing all of the above I replaced the digital controls on the door with a new one. The old digital door controls looked fine. No bulging caps, no scorch marks. Looked brand new.

This produced no different results.

At this point I am at a loss. There can only be so many things that can go wrong. All seems to be working with the POSSIBLE exception of the relay under load or a defective new part unless there is another item I am missing.

a) The compressor seems to be working fine with adequate freon.

b) The Defrost Heater is new and appears to be working fine with no ice buildup and with light frost on all evaporator coils.

c) New thermistor temp control near fan. Spliced onto existing wiring. Used liquid tape to seal wire nuts.

d) Fan appears to be working correctly.

d) New digital door controls.

e) Door seals appear to be sealing correctly. Tested with dollar bill for tightness.

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I can post pics if this is possible on here. Please state what you would like to see.

Thanks,
Clark

 

[Clark6]

Anybody have any input on this? Would greatly appreciate some help.

Thanks,

Clark

[dfphoto]

did you check the evap fan? what measurement did you have on the thermistor splicing that was not a good idea you are allowing water and humidity into the wiring.  you need to do a full computer check no offense these are the most complicated devices of all...

Edited August 22 by dfphoto

[Clark6]

16 hours ago, dfphoto said:

did you check the evap fan? what measurement did you have on the thermistor splicing that was not a good idea you are allowing water and humidity into the wiring.  you need to do a full computer check no offense these are the most complicated devices of all...

 

    16 hours ago, dfphoto said:

    did you check the evap fan? what measurement did you have on the thermistor splicing that was not a good idea you are allowing water and humidity into the wiring.  you need to do a full computer check no offense these are the most complicated devices of all...

[Click and drag to move]

Hi dfphoto, thank you for the reply.

The evap fan works and fact that is one of the problems is that it runs excessively. I also observed it running when taking the interior facing off.

The thermistor that is connected to the interior of the freezer, screwed to the wall of the interior near the fan, I spliced in using wire nuts. I then sealed the interior of the nut with liquid tape so it shouldn't be a problem for water or humidity reaching the splice.

This new part was not a frigidaire genuine part but was made in U.S.A. by Wholesale Sensors part #297018400.

https://www.amazon.com/Wholesale-Sensors-297018400-Thermistor-18-Month/dp/B07D7HY41R

The Sears PartsDirect lists the thermister for my freezer, Kenmore 253-28459810, as part # 297018400 that replaces part # 7297018400. Thus said it should be the same part?

I did not test the thermister as there was no way to test it without cutting it out of the wiring anyway. Also testing this, other than room temperature, would be undoable at different freezer temps to open/close the circuit thus making it improbable for me at least to test unless you could advise me how to test it a different way?

Not sure what you mean by full computer check? If you are talking about the digital controls with a CB on the door I bought a brand new one and it performed the same as the existing controls. I then returned the new controls and put back the old one as it performed the same.

What do you think? Any suggestions?

 

 

[Clark6]

1 minute ago, Clark6 said:

 

 

    16 hours ago, dfphoto said:

    did you check the evap fan? what measurement did you have on the thermistor splicing that was not a good idea you are allowing water and humidity into the wiring.  you need to do a full computer check no offense these are the most complicated devices of all...

[Click and drag to move]

Hi dfphoto, thank you for the reply.

The evap fan works and fact that is one of the problems is that it runs excessively. I also observed it running when taking the interior facing off.

The thermistor that is connected to the interior of the freezer, screwed to the wall of the interior near the fan, I spliced in using wire nuts. I then sealed the interior of the nut with liquid tape so it shouldn't be a problem for water or humidity reaching the splice.

This new part was not a frigidaire genuine part but was made in U.S.A. by Wholesale Sensors part #297018400.

https://www.amazon.com/Wholesale-Sensors-297018400-Thermistor-18-Month/dp/B07D7HY41R

The Sears PartsDirect lists the thermister for my freezer, Kenmore 253-28459810, as part # 297018400 that replaces part # 7297018400. Thus said it should be the same part?

I did not test the thermister as there was no way to test it without cutting it out of the wiring anyway. Also testing this, other than room temperature, would be undoable at different freezer temps to open/close the circuit thus making it improbable for me at least to test unless you could advise me how to test it a different way?

Not sure what you mean by full computer check? If you are talking about the digital controls with a CB on the door I bought a brand new one and it performed the same as the existing controls. I then returned the new controls and put back the old one as it performed the same.

What do you think? Any suggestions?

 

 

Sorry on thing I forgot to ask... Were you talking about the temp thermistor screwed to the freezer's interior or the thermistor in the control module relay that connects to the compressor? I could not test this part under load but only at room temperature. If this is what you were talking about could this be a problem that I am running into?

[dfphoto]

thermistors usually do not burn out they go out of spec so they have various voltage ratings to determine spec at the temp you are in at the time of testing. Resistance is not an accurate measurement they only say that everywhere because they don't want liability for electrocution LOL. of course you machine doesn't have voltage ratings so... very tight tolerance in resistance wouldn't you say?

I didn't look at your wiring I assume you have some computer board on this and that's where you test the thermistor or where it plugs into the harness.

in ice water this is the resistance cannot be beyond the two numbers

		Nominal Resistance Ohms	max	min	tolerance
0°	32°	32,654	33,604.72	31703.29	2.91

Edited August 23 by dfphoto

[dfphoto]

I would check defrost thermistor it's probably the issue my mistake you don't seem to have a freezer thermistor but I would say you need the OEM not a generic... and you are right you had to splice it in.

Look this is a freezer only I did not understand that, the thermistor in the evaporator area get direct 120v and is a major component to the computer so you need the OEM there if that's good you have to check voltage to the computer and out and then if that is okay you need AC testing equipment also says temp needs to be less than 110 if this is in a garage and it's hot that could be the problem. you have a tough one I'm not the expert in refrigerators etc... I have to worry about 3 refrigerator jobs I have going now... its a simple system but you need to be clear on the thermistor situation first then board then AC

Edited August 23 by dfphoto

[Clark6]

On 8/23/2024 at 10:15 AM, dfphoto said:

I would check defrost thermistor it's probably the issue my mistake you don't seem to have a freezer thermistor but I would say you need the OEM not a generic... and you are right you had to splice it in.

Look this is a freezer only I did not understand that, the thermistor in the evaporator area get direct 120v and is a major component to the computer so you need the OEM there if that's good you have to check voltage to the computer and out and then if that is okay you need AC testing equipment also says temp needs to be less than 110 if this is in a garage and it's hot that could be the problem. you have a tough one I'm not the expert in refrigerators etc... I have to worry about 3 refrigerator jobs I have going now... its a simple system but you need to be clear on the thermistor situation first then board then AC

Thanks dfphoto. I will try and get to checking this out. I just wanted to post some photo's of what the freezer and items inside to test look like. I will post the wiring diagram, the interior wiring, the relay and compressor. Let me know what you think...

[Clark6]

Here is the digital controls and the insert on the door pics. The digital controls plug into the door.

[dfphoto]

focus on the thermistor tolerance... that's a very tight window and you need to know 100% that your generic is reacting exactly in the tolerance range.

[Clark6]

1 hour ago, dfphoto said:

focus on the thermistor tolerance... that's a very tight window and you need to know 100% that your generic is reacting exactly in the tolerance range.

Thanks again. I think I will order the OEM thermister and take a $16 loss.

You don't think then that the Thermister in the relay could have anything to do with this type of behavior? If not that would save me $50+

[dfphoto]

you don't have to take a loss measure the damn thing in line with whatever I copied and see if you get it within the 2% tolerance. put the thermistor in a plastic bag dip in water for 10 min then measure and if you get 31-33k it's fine if not throw it out

Edited August 29 by dfphoto

[dfphoto]

put putty or caulk or silicone where the wires go into the box seal it up.

[dfphoto]

 297216600

defrost thermostat is probably the problem at least check it

[Clark6]

16 hours ago, dfphoto said:

 297216600

defrost thermostat is probably the problem at least check it

It is a brand new unit. I replaced the thermostat and the defrost element.

I am going to be gone for the holiday weekend. Will check the thermister on the freezer wall next week. Also am assuming that the thermister in the relay doesn't matter as to the symptoms I have described?

Thanks dfphoto I appreciate the help.

[Clark6]

On 8/29/2024 at 3:29 PM, dfphoto said:

you don't have to take a loss measure the damn thing in line with whatever I copied and see if you get it within the 2% tolerance. put the thermistor in a plastic bag dip in water for 10 min then measure and if you get 31-33k it's fine if not throw it out

I tested the ohms on the new and the old temp thermister as follows:

Tested in 32° iced salt water

Old thermister:
Room Temp. 70° - 12.8 - 13.04 K ohms
32 ° - 31.53 k ohms

Test 2:
Room Temp. 70° - 11.05 K ohms
32° - 32.96 k ohms
ohms dropped quickly once removed from water in all instances.

============

New off brand thermister:
Room Temp. 70° - 10.94 k ohms
32° - 33.63 k ohms - started to slowly drop to 33.43 k held there for a while then slowly dropped into the 32 k ohm range.

Removed from ice water. Lowered to 11.20 k ohms.

Test 2:
Room Temp. 70° - 12.78 K ohms
32° - 33.41 k ohms

ohms dropped quickly once removed from water in all instances.

Unless I am reading this wrong they both seem within tolerances? The next test I will do is check the voltage going into the digital control panel and the voltage going into the temp. thermister correct?

If within tolerances then the problem is somewhere else? Would the thermister in the compressor relay have anything to do with the temp variation?

NOTE: This freezer in in house at room temp. The defrost thermostat is brand new with a new element.

 

 

[dfphoto]

remove the panel inside the unit so we can see the evaporator frost pattern... take everything out take the rear panel shoot some pictures wide and close up of the top and the bottom look at the drain tubes pull them off see if they are restricted see if there is an ice ball on the top over the sensor

[Clark6]

14 hours ago, dfphoto said:

remove the panel inside the unit so we can see the evaporator frost pattern... take everything out take the rear panel shoot some pictures wide and close up of the top and the bottom look at the drain tubes pull them off see if they are restricted see if there is an ice ball on the top over the sensor

I will splice in the NEW temp thermister after checking for voltage. Then turn it on and let it come to temp. Then give you a full view pic of the inside of freezer with front cover off.

The drain plug has never been frozen over to my knowledge. I will check again when I run the freezer to temp. The drain tube is clear. The defrost water for the compressor tube goes into a plastic container that is located on top of the compressor. This has been full of water (even with the old defrost element and thermostat) so I believe the defrost is working ok and not freezing up.

The evaporator panel of tubes has never iced up. There has been a light frost over the entire evaporator tube panel but not more than that. I will check this again when I fire it up. The frost was NOT just on one area of the tubes indicating freon/compressor problems.

[Clark6]

On 9/4/2024 at 5:49 PM, dfphoto said:

remove the panel inside the unit so we can see the evaporator frost pattern... take everything out take the rear panel shoot some pictures wide and close up of the top and the bottom look at the drain tubes pull them off see if they are restricted see if there is an ice ball on the top over the sensor

I believe I got the freezer working.

Tested all the electronics and seemed fine. I believe this was the culprit:

Freezer Electronic Control Board #216954214 - $55.00

This was the 'relay' shown above that connects to the compressor. I thought this along with the Capacitor were related only to how the compressor ran. This appears not to be true. I tested this and it SEEMED to test out ok with a meter but I believe the thermistor inside this part must have been damaged due to a surge.

After doing more research on this here is the description I found... "Electronic control board 216954214 manages the functions of the freezer such as the temperature settings and defrost cycle time."

Running out of more idea's I bought this part and installed it. I also put the original temp thermister located inside the freezer back in and removed the one I bought with the same part number but not Frigidaire. After starting the freezer up I believe that so far all is running ok. Seems to bring it within the temp range plus an minus and is actually shutting itself off.

Still keeping an eye on the temps and if anything weird will post back here.

So just wanted to say THANK YOU. You really helped me out on this and I might never have gotten this freezer to run correctly. This saved me over $900+ cost for a new replacement freezer.

[dfphoto]

Great