Hydrocarbon Refrigerants

[Kyess]

 

Hi all,

 

While looking into alternative refrigerants the other day, I came across a site for Hydro-Cool [.]http://www.hydrocoolonline.com]. Has anyone in this forum used either of the HC 12a/134+ or HC 22a/502a hydrocarbon refrigerants? I have never heard of these before and am considering trying them, but would like to know if others have experience with them before purchasing. I am concerned with liability issues regarding the potential flammability hazard but I am also aware that this hazard exists with many other common refrigerants, to a lesser degree, under the right circumstances.

If they are legitimately as good as they sound, I’m wondering why they haven’t taken the world by storm

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

Kyess

 

[Kyess]

After looking these over again carefully, I think I’ll pass on them for a while. Didn’t see any UL label listing info on website and I don’t really want to have to worry about the fire and explosion hazards if a customer’s system ever develops a leak, which is always a possibility. This seems to be the biggest drawback for these products.  More than likely, local building and fire codes as well as insurance underwriters would probably require special alarm warning devices when hydrocarbon refrigerant filled equipment is located in a building. Maybe one of the big reasons why these particular products haven’t caught on in this country yet.

 

 

[AccApp]

The new refrigerant for A/C systems, R410a, is actually a blend of two refrigerants. One of them is almost the perfect refrigerant (R32), problem is it is flammable. When it is blended with R125 the mixture becomes non-flammable.

[Samurai Appliance Repair Man]

Propane (a hydrocarbon, C3H8) used to be widely used as a refrigerant before Dupont launched a massive propaganda campaign against it when it introduced R-12 back in the 1940's. It's an excellent refrigerant with very favorable thermodynamic properties, carries oil well, has zero ozone depletion potential and is cheap.

"Well it won't be so cheap when your refrigerator explodes! Duh-HEE!"

Do you know that that has never happened, even when propane was used as a refrigerant in industrial settings?

I have charged several domestic appliances with propane. A dehumidifier I charged ran for 10 years. It would still be running today except I dumped it because it was so damn noisy.

Fun facts to know and tell.

[Keinokuorma]

Also it is fun to think about the fact that usually a refrigerant leak happens slowly and unnoticed, at such low rates that it is unlikely that a combustible or toxic air/gas mixture would form, unless in an unventilated room... and what, again, has been said, writted, yelled, and otherwise communicated to people, about using refrigeration systems in an unventilated room?

[applianceman18007260692]

old chinese saying:

never pressurize ice box with propane and check for leaks with halide torch!

[JDenyer232]

The Fermented Grand Master is correct, propane, butane, and other hydrocarbon mixes make great refrigerants. In fact in Europe they are now starting to use hydrocarbon refrigerants in new domestic appliances, as they start the phaseout of HFC based refrigerants due to global warming concerns. In the US their use is not yet allowed due to flammability issues, even though to date there has not been any evidence that hydrocarbon refrigerants pose any more hazard than their fluorinated counterparts. Personally I would not use them on someone elses appliances, on my own appliances that's one thing, I just wouldn't want any liability issues should something happen. Some day hydrocarbon refrigerants will be accepted as mainstream here in the US, until then we will just have to pay the high prices for the approved ones.

[jehiatt]

I never heard of Hc 134a or the others gases mentioned but I I did buy a 30 lbs canister  of ES12A two years ago. It a butane substitute for R12  and probably the same type of products you are looking at but from a different company.

I put it in my 79 chevy van ( pumped it down a bit first) and my 89 Oldsmobile Delta 88.  I have cold Air conditioning. .  I regassed both vehicles last year and again a month ago. 

I used one of the ES groups stop-leaks in my Olds this year but won't know for awhile if it works.

I bought a 30 lb of R22 last month for home units for $88.00 .  I would like to try the HC22A or ES22A . Their website site says it's $145.00 today.  Oh! Oh! it ought to be $33.00. Woody Jim