How do I get the furnace blower out when gas exhaust is in the way?

[runderwo]

I have a Weathermaker 8000 gas furnace w/electronic ignition. The blower has been seizing when it heats up (set to ON, i.e. without furnace running). I replaced the run capacitor but it still overheats/seizes. Need to get it out and diagnose/replace, but the vertical gas vent pipe is in the way of pulling the blower. At the bottom the pipe squares off and is siliconed to the heat exchanger, so I can't pull it through the top. Seems like I would have to remove a bunch of stuff at the bottom just to pull the pipe out the bottom. The furnace is stuffed into a closet since i'm on a slab. Any recommendations?

[RegUS_PatOff]

post some pictures somewhere http://www.imageshack.us/

then post the links here

[runderwo]

I will when I am able, thought maybe this was a common problem with an obvious solution, since I'm pretty stupid.

[ACtechGUY]

WOW, I dread these type of furnaces.

1st step. remove the vent pipe from the furnace.

2nd step ...... this is where it sucks.... figure out how to remove the vent pipe and box around it blocking the blower in. ( it can be done!!!)

3rd step remove control board that is in the way... then take out blower section...

THis is a crappy setup and is not to easy to do as a homeowner.

Reinstall the vent pipe with HIGH TEMP SILICONE to stop exhaust gases from leaking into the airstream.

GoodLuck

[runderwo]

Here are two different angled pics. How does the vent pipe come out? The box is only a problem because the pipe is in the way of removing a screw. The pipe can't come out because it has a box part which is attached (with silicone) underneath the blower rack, so it can't be pulled through the top.

[Budget Appliance Repair]

From the pictures it appears that even if you get the vent pipe out you will still have the flat metal bars along side the vent that appear to be riveted into place.

I wouldn't think you should have to be drilling rivets out of the vent sheet metal protective shield to remove a blower motor.

You have not supplied a valid model number, (HINT: Weathermaker 8000 is not the model number used to look up parts, that most likely is just the name of the unit on the front cover). You need to supply the model and serial number off the tag that has all that info.

There is a possibility that the other side of the furnace also has a removable door that is to be remove to remove the blower motor, (that surely doesn't seem like a good way to build them though because with most furnaces you don't have access to all sides, usually only what you have is the normal access available).

Edited to add: looking closer at the picture it does appear the sheet metal around the vent pipe unscrews from the flange, (at least at the top), that is riveted to the top and bottom area around the vent pipe.

How about a picture of the area where the vent pipe attaches to the draft inducer motor, (where it is siliconed). Maybe you will need to remove the draft inducer motor assembly to get the vent pipe out.

[ACtechGUY]

The way this works is you pull the round vent pipe out . there are no screws holding it in place, just silicone( I think) . Once the round pipe is out then you must find the attachment points for the square box that surrounds the round pipe . remove square box. pull blower.

NO OTHER WAY TO DISASEMBLE THIS FURNACE!!!! NO BACK DOOR!!! furnaces never have back doors.

**************** When reassembling , ,, You MUST Seal box and vent pipe with HIGH TEMP SILICONE, since the pipe passes thru the blower section.

[runderwo]

Sorry I didn't come back, it's been too cold to work on it in the garage and we have just been burning wood in the meantime.

Weathermaker 8000 is the only model number I can locate anywhere on the furnace. There are lots of stickers, a schematic, etc but each just has the part number of the sticker itself and nothing else as far as I can tell. Could be there is something missing since it's old and I haven't lived here the whole time.

I did figure out where the "seam" on the vent pipe is, it's right where that one screw is at the bottom. Unfortunately, mine seems to be completely stuck together to where it didn't even seem to be two pieces at first. I don't know if it's corrosion or silicone sealer that is holding on so well. I tried liquid wrench (on the inside), a propane torch, and a mallet so far. Not sure what else is safe to try. Ideas?

[ACtechGUY]

The model number is on the inside side of the case in the burner section. It probably faces in a direction that is hard for you to see. The model or product number will start with a 58

I think you furnace is this My link. That will be the only manual available ., and it does not address blower removal.

[runderwo]

I enlisted a helper to lever the lower manifold part to keep it in place while I applied propane heat, cussed, and used both hands to pull up on that vent pipe. Got it loose. It was really old silicone that had it stuck good in place.

I got the blower out. The motor is a GE. It is labeled to oil with SAE 20 non-detergent oil. It is also quite dirty. I don't think it's burned up because it runs until it gets hot. I think it just needs lube, but I don't know where to oil it. There are no obvious/marked oil ports. There is something of a "cap" over the shaft on the non-business end that I can't tell whether it should be removed or not. I think if I clean and lube this bad boy I'll be back in business. Does the squirrel case need to be removed to access oil ports?

[Budget Appliance Repair]

Don't waste your time trying to fix the old motor, you will just have to be pulling it out again to do it right.

Once the bushings starting seizing up they are so dry if you try to lube them they just gum up again. All the lube is gone from the porous pre-lubed bushings.

If it has places to oil the bushings, (they usually recommend a drop or two of oil every 3 to 6 months), there should be a little tube at each end that leads to the bushing area. The tube is usually just another flat piece of sheet metal spot welded to the end housing on the inside of the motor, (at both ends), that has a little channel in it to create the oil tube.

The inside oil port can be difficult to get to sometimes but you shouldn't have to remove the blower wheel to get to it if you have a ZOOM spout oiler, (brand name of oil in a squeeze bottle with a long extending tube to reach way down into tight areas).

[runderwo]

I'm okay with replacing the motor instead of oiling it if it's the best practice. It is old and of unknown maintenance history.

It is labeled a GE 5KCP39JG, 1/3 hp 1075 RPM 115VAC left rotation, and has 4 wires to the control board and 2 wires for the 5uF 370V run capacitor. I don't think it is multi-speed in actual use but I could be wrong. Is a replacement available on this site? Could it be replaced with a 1/4 HP or would the weaker motor burn up?

[Budget Appliance Repair]

You never want to change from the original manufactures spec part, (Shaft length & diameter, Rotation-some are reversible by wiring or other means, HP, RPM, VOLTS, AMPS, # of speeds-can use a single or two speed motor if that is all that is being used on the current motor, motor body diameter & length) all need to be the same as the original. You also should stay with run capacitor required motor.

With four wires from the motor going to the control board the motor is most likely a 3 speed motor, one wire would be common, (probably white), the other 3 wires would be Low, Med, High speed. You would be using two of the three speeds, one for cooling and one for heating. The third unused speed would be on a PARK(Just a spare spot to hook the loose wire) terminal on the board. It looks like the yellow wire from the wall t-stat is hooked up so you very well could have an AC system coupled with the furnace system so you would need at least a two speed motor.

NOTE: I see 5 wires coming from the motor to the control board which would make that a 4 speed motor, (White, Black, Red, Blue, Yellow)

I'm sure there is a replacement available from RepairClinic but some research would need to be done.

The GE motor number seems to be incomplete: 5KCP39JG only came up with one match of 5KCP39JGJ997T which comes up as a 2 speed 220 volt motor on this page:

http://www.electricmotorwarehouse.com/aosmith/Carrier_Furnace_Motor.htm

search for "GE 3066", the next one under that is a 115 Volt 4 speed motor but rotation maybe the wrong direction depending on how you determined rotation of your current motor, (Rotation: CCW Lead End means looking at the end the wire leads go into, the shaft turns CCW which would be CW from shaft end which it appears from your picture your motor is).

Here's another good site for motor research: http://www.fasco.com/xref_list.asp

[runderwo]

5kcp39jgs170s must be the complete model number. Did not realize those bigger letters & numbers were part of it.

[runderwo]

I found a 5KCP39HG9174AS which matches on everything except shaft length and it is rated at 6.0 A instead of 5.8 A on mine. Will that be okay and I will just cut the shaft to size?

[RegUS_PatOff]

I'm not a HVAC master, but I would think that's OK

are the frame & mounting, and speed the same ?

[runderwo]

Yes, everything else is the same, it just rated to pull .2 A more current. I think it is because it is a slightly older model.

Update: Found out that the shaft measurement is wrong. I was given the full shaft length while on my old one I was measuring the exposed length. That motor would have far too short, not too long a shaft. But I think I found the right motor now. Thanks a lot for your help everyone.

[Budget Appliance Repair]

The .2 amps difference will be OK.

The shaft length isn't real critical as long as it's not to short of coarse.

Don't try to cut the shaft to make it shorter, there isn't any need to do that. You have plenty of room for it to just stick out the other side of the blower wheel, a longer shaft then your current one is OK.

Depending on how much of the shaft of the original motor already is sticking out the end of the blower wheel you can have a shorter shaft on the new motor as long as there is enough for at least a quarter inch or so to stick thru when the blower wheel is centered in the blower cage.

The 5KCP39HG9174AS motor you have listed should have a plenty long shaft, (it shows in the specs as 5 1/8" long).

I found your exact old motor on Ebay (Used)$99.99+FREE shipping and it list the shaft length as 4 1/2" long.

http://cgi.e bay.com/Carrier-GE-1-3-HP-BLOWER-MOTOR-HC41AE115A-5KCP39JGS170S-/350426633327?pt=Air_Conditioner&hash=item51970e146f

[runderwo]

Thanks for all the help everyone.