Caloric ESR 206-26 oven temperature control problem

[eidling]

Our ancient oven, which I have managed to keep limping along with the help of Appliantology in the past is having another problem.  When we turn the oven control knob the light that indicates it is working is somewhat intermittent.  To be clear, the oven is working when the light is on - my question  isn't about the light, it's about the oven working intermittently.

Is the most likely problem the control itself or something else?  If it is the control, I have looked online, but am not sure whether the part is available or not.  If it would help, I can take the cover off the back of the control panel to photograph the control and post it here.

I haven't opened things up to look at the control, but might contact cleaner help with this kind of problem?

 Thanks in advance for any help that will be offered!

 

[eidling]

Sorry to have received no responses.  On the odd chance that I can find a replacement part, what is the correct term for this control?  Is it oven temperature control or something else?

Thanks!

[Hiroshi]

It sounds like you are describing a "pilot lamp" that indicates the unit is in a heating cycle- In older models, electromechanical controls are referred to as the Oven Thermostat. If you are having intermittent issues, I would give the wiring a good look to be sure a mouse hasn't been nibbling on things and that the connections are all tight, because thermostats are usually pretty solid. The model# you have posted is incomplete/incorrect... If this is a freestanding range, look for an embossed plate under the cooktop for the model and serial info, then we can determine if the control is available.

[eidling]

Hi Hiroshi,

Thanks so much for writing back.  I believe the pilot light works because when the oven works it goes on.  However, since my last posting, the control (which I believe is the problem) has stopped working entirely.  I thought I took the model number accurately from the embossed plate, however I see that an older posting I made some years ago I listed the range as a 306-26.   I don't know how to read a schematic, but at the time I posted the schematic from our range here:    https://picasaweb.go...447672977931378  

I will double check the model number when I get home and will also include the serial number in a fresh post.

I neglected to mention that, after my initial posting, I did open things up and look at the back of the control, which has lots of wires connected to it.  https://picasaweb.google.com/113204121821030060704/6290908092729642081#6290908096329063154

An additional problem with the unit is there are three dials on the front (timer, clock, etc.) that have seen better days and are quite finicky.  I also tried to find a replacement for it, without success. Sometimes in the past, when my wife has dialed these in perfectly, the oven will start to work.  Maybe we will get lucky and that will happen again!

We've been keeping this thing going with a wing and a prayer for over 30 years, so if it is time to retire it, we really can't complain.  Still, if that part is available and we keep it going a bit longer, I wouldn't mind it!

 

Thanks again!

 

Michael

[Hiroshi]

Appliancetimers.com rebuilds older mechanical timers... Have you checked with them? The model number you listed is not valid anywhere I run it.

[eidling]

here is the info.  I apologize for listing the model incorrectly!

[eidling]

and the part looks like this:

[Budget Appliance Repair]

Check the clock timed cook dials, (the two smaller clocks), to make sure it hasn't got set to a timed bake setting and the stop time has been met.

I don't know the specifics of this one but for manual bake settings both small clocks should be at the same time setting as the main clock, (even if the clock doesn't work anymore), and on some you have to push the START time clock know in for manual bake.   Read the instructions around the clock if there are any.

You also have a 225 degree Hi-Limit safety t-stat in line with L2 common for bake and broil, (It maybe a reset-able safety, would have a little button in center that can be pushed to reset).   If it isn't a reset-able safety check it with your meter.

Oven t-stat could be the problem but as Hiroshi said, they are usually pretty solid.

Check the Hi-Limit safety t-stat before doing the below check of the heater relay.

This unit uses a Hot-Wire/Heater Relay to also control the the bake and broil elements, to check it put the t-tstat in bake and put your one meter lead on H1 and the other on L on the heater relay, if you get a reading of 240 VAC then the heater relay is bad, also check the broil by putting t-stat in broil on meter lead on H2 and other on L on the heater relay, if bad you will see 240 VAC.

[eidling]

Thanks Sensei Willie!  Will try these things, hopefully tonight after work. 

I have a meter, but do not know how to use it, so I would need "idiot's guide" instructions.  I have used the meter in the past when guided by someone who tells me what to do. 

What I would really love to do is by-pass the timer, etc. unit, so the control would (hopefully) work independent of those controls which we never use, but I do not understand circuitry enough to know how to do that (assuming it is possible....).  It just seems to me that taking these out of the equation might make sense, if it's posibble. 

Thanks so much for these suggestions!  I really appreciate your guidance on this!

Michael

[eidling]

took a quick shot of the timer/clock controls before leaving this a.m..  I moved them around some, hoping the oven would come on, but it didn't.  The middle dial pops up at a certain point when it is turned.  A reset light comes on at times.  I'm sorry if I sound like a dope, but if you tell me how you think they should be set, please do.

Will look at the other issues you mentioned, hopefully this evening.

Thanks again!

[eidling]

Still not home to try the things you mentioned, however if I do need to replace the control, it think this is it:

http://www.repairclinic.com/PartDetail/Temperature-Control-Thermostat/0042076/318614?ss=-x30303432303736

The bad news is, at least on this site, it is no longer available.  To be continued!

[eidling]

"Check the clock timed cook dials, (the two smaller clocks), to make sure it hasn't got set to a timed bake setting and the stop time has been met."

• Messed with the dials, didn't get the right combo.

"You also have a 225 degree Hi-Limit safety t-stat in line with L2 common for bake and broil, (It maybe a reset-able safety, would have a little button in center that can be pushed to reset).   If it isn't a reset-able safety check it with your meter."

• Here is what things look like from above with the panel that covers the control off.  Where do I look for the Hi-limit safety?

"Check the Hi-Limit safety t-stat before doing the below check of the heater relay."

• Will wait to see if it is resettable.  If not will ask for more details about how to use the meter.  By the way, the timer/clock unit looks like it only has two wires coming out of it.  Might there be a way to by-pass the unit entirely?  If so, could someone tell me how to do it?

 

• There is a label on the unit.  I doubt I can find one anywhere, based on my previous attempts, but this is what it looks like:

  

Thanks again.  This is as far as I can take it tonight.  Looking forward to any additional suggestions!!

[Budget Appliance Repair]

If the timed cooking clocks are in the positions you have in the picture then that is your problem.

Read the instructions under the dials where it says: MANUAL --->
1. Turn  start timer knob until it pops out, (that will be when it matches the time on the main clock)
2. (This is your problem), Set it to MANUAL,  not OFF!   (this one isn't a clock like most, it is the time in hours you want to cook for 1-6 hours.  When it gets to OFF the oven turns off and you have to set the dial back to MANUAL for normal manual/untimed baking).

I'm not sure where the Hi-Limit Safety T-stat is on yours, sometimes they are on the back of the range behind the panel that covers the wiring on the back.

Five wires going to clock plus two additional wires for the clock motor, (it looks like there's a cover over the rear of the clock so you can't see all the wires connect to it).   I really doubt your problem is in the clock timer circuit contacts anyway, the contacts don't open/close on a regular basis to arch the points and damage them.  The contacts on the clock only open and close when you change the setting from manual to timed, use the clean cycle or timed bake mode.
 

Edited June 2, 2016 by Budget Appliance Repair

[eidling]

Thank you again!  I fiddled with the knobs last night (prior to your most recent posting) and did get the oven to turn on.  Of course, I don't know exactly what I did, but the knobs now look like this: 

I notice it still points to "off" instead of "manual," but the knob on that dial pulls off with the stem (!!), so it may not be aligned quite correctly!

If we have the problem again (which wouldn't surprise me!), I will try your instructions.  The timer unit is a mess - the glass is no longer there, having broken while it was being cleaned, etc. The unit is ugly to say the least, but as long as we can use it to cook it fits perfectly within our budget (which includes nothing for new appliances) !!

Thanks so much for your help - for being patient, detailed and clear.  I really appreciate it!!

Michael

 

[Budget Appliance Repair]

The hours to bake/OFF/MANUAL knob is NOT a push/pull just turn it to the correct setting.

Do you mean when you pull the knob off, not only the knob but the complete metal shaft with the red pointer physically pulls out of the clock unit?  If that is the case, it sound like it may be broken off inside the clock unit and when you turn it you aren't actually turning the internal mechanism that would open/close the points for manual/timed bake.

Looks like you still don't have the start time clock set correctly, (it needs to match the hour hand time that the main clock is at, the knob should pop out a when at that position).  It may already be popped out, push it in and let go of it then slowly and carefully turn it until it matches the 1 O'Clock position the main clock is at and you should fell the knob pop out.

Then turn the oven t-stat to a bake position and try turning the 3rd clock, (Hour to bake/OFF/MANUAL), to manual.  If the shaft is actually broken off like I asked above, try pushing in to see if maybe you can get the broken end to engage the other part that should be inside the clock unit and get it to a position where the oven turns on.

[eidling]

Do you mean when you pull the knob off, not only the knob but the complete metal shaft with the red pointer physically pulls out of the clock unit?  If that is the case, it sound like it may be broken off inside the clock unit and when you turn it you aren't actually turning the internal mechanism that would open/close the points for manual/timed bake.

• Yes, the shaft comes out - it is broken.

Looks like you still don't have the start time clock set correctly, (it needs to match the hour hand time that the main clock is at, the knob should pop out a when at that position).  It may already be popped out, push it in and let go of it then slowly and carefully turn it until it matches the 1 O'Clock position the main clock is at and you should fell the knob pop out.

• Given the fact that the oven is currently working, I am reluctant to move anything at this point.  These are great instructions and if it stops working again, I will try exactly what you have suggested, but I am concerned about doing anything that might result in the oven not working again. Then again, I might feel like taking a risk and messing with it.  If I do, I will report back.  Thanks a million for all your help!!