Amana ART2527AW Refrigerator: Freezer good, refrig marginal

[Larbo]

Hi,

My 20 yr old 25cuft Amana top freezer unit has been running for 20 years at -10 to 0 degF in the freezer and 35degF in the refrigerator below. Suddently, the frig part is now 6 to 9 degF warmer, freezer  is unchanged. 

I checked the seals, the coils, the fans and the compressor. All are either clean, working great or not overheating. No iced lines that I can see. Despite that we are in self-isolation because of the virus, the frigde and freezer are not over-stuffed and the freezer vents are wide open.

Not sure what to do next. I tried to take the rear cover off the back of the freezer unit to look at the defrost stuff and coils. I read that sometimes those issues can arise. I couldn't for the life of me get that cover off.

Thanks for you assistance!

Larbo

[Vance R]

Since the refrigerator section is cooled by airflow from the freezer. Evaporator fan could be slow. Air supply and return ducts could be restricted. 

[TheHelicopterKid]

You may not be getting a complete defrost which would restrict proper airflow - which lines up with what @Vance R is saying as well.

[16345Ed]

10 hours ago, Larbo said:

I read that sometimes those issues can arise. I couldn't for the life of me get that cover off.

Likely frosted up will need to manually defrost to remove cover. 

[Larbo]

Afraid of that. The airflow out of the freezer vents feel as strong as ever (not very scientific, I know). Luckily, in this model, the vents are on the top and in the front of the bottom of hte freezer. Usually, pretty easy to keep clear (except maybe just after having gone COVID-19 shopping?) .

What is the likelihood that this issue is caused by a malfunction that will only occur again after I go through the ordeal of defrosting it? Or, could it just be situationally caused like a temporarily blocked vent and defrosting will clear it? 

Thanks!!!

[Larbo]

Would turning the freezer temp setting to minimum facilitate a melting of the ice? Just thinking inside the box  

[Larbo]

About defrosting it:

1. I would have to pull the fridge out to get to the plug. Will just turning the Freezer OFF do it?? 

2. Will the drain pan in the back overflow?? (so will I have to pull it out anyway or maybe I can just drop some towels back there from above??) 

3. Because of the very cramped quarters, I cannot pull it out and AND also have the doors open. It would be one or the other. Thanks

[Vance R]

1. nope, just find the defrost timer and advance to defrost.  From a couple of web sites the timer is near the controls. Google the exploded views to find. Repair clinic has videos on defrost timers.

2. Yes it may overflow the drain pan. How ever you can get the towels near the pan in your situation.

3. Should have to move it out, most of the work is from the front.

[Larbo]

Vance R, didn't see your post till after I flipped the breaker and am letting it warm up.

1. 12 hours enough?

2. I finally found the defrost timer. I will run that if necessary after I get'er up and running tomorrow and see what happens.

3. The defrost timer on the model is part of a panel that unscrews from the roof of the fridge compartment and includes the fridge light sw. I tried to open it up, starting with the front edge, but didn't have much luck. One side seems willing but the other side is not. Maybe after everything melts it will. The rear screws of that panel are at the end of 2" long "legs" and are totally full of ice.

4. I found no videos that were of much help. I think since this model is at least 20 years old. Found owenr's manuals but no repair manuals.

Thanks. Be back tomorrow.

 

[Vance R]

Most timers have one - way screw or shaft to advance into or out of defrost - usual red in color.

[Larbo]

Not much water this morning, mostly in the front instead of in the back (not overflow, as expected). Turned on the freezer, waited about 10 minutes and then turned the red defrost timer screw clockwise until it clicked. The compressor stopped. Now waiting. Should I be able to feel any warmth from the heater through the rear wall of the freezer? 

I am still unable to drop the control panel with the defrost sw (from the ceiling of the refrigator box, even with all 4 screws removed. Don't want to force it. Something is very stuck. 

[Vance R]

40 minutes ago, Larbo said:

Should I be able to feel any warmth from the heater through the rear wall of the freezer?

Sometimes you can feel warmth or see red glow or hear sizzle of water on heater.

[Larbo]

No warmth or sizzle. Too bright to see a glow. This unit has been on for almost 4 hours now. The freezer is at 0 and the fridge is at 40 (again). Freezer is set at 4 of 7 and fridge is at 7 of 7. 

The control panel will still not drop from the roof of the fridge. Makes me wonder why. That is where the air damper is, along with the defrost timer.  Am I barking up the wrong tree? \

 

[Vance R]

30 minutes ago, Larbo said:

Am I barking up the wrong tree? \

From the exploded view can't tell how it comes apart.

Did the timer come out of defrost by itself in 20ish minutes?

If the symptoms return in about 10 days you have a defrost problem. Heater, bi-metal or timer.

[Larbo]

Yeah, the exploded view is not very helpful.... and no video to be had. Just 4 screws. I can post a good pic of it for reference. I would think with the all night vacation and the first thing defrost, we should be cold as heck first thing and it did not get below 40 again. Remember, it ran at appx 35deg for at least the last 10 years until a week ago. 

Don't see an FAQ on how to post an image. Do I have to put it on photobucket or something first or can I just upload it from my computer?  Thanks

 

[Vance R]

Not sure on how it works for posting picture in diy section. Think it is a photo service and a link.

[Larbo]

Is is now a couple more hours later and the fridge is now 45-50 degF. Freezer still 0 degF. 

Yes, the defrost cycled out automatically in about 20 min. 30 min later found the compressor running and unit cooling (per your earlier question).

Removal, 2 screws in front corners, remove the mullion heater switch slider and two more screws in deep stanchions along the rear towards the center. No other screws. Defrost timer is evident, too.

[Larbo]

So, all of the refrigerator cooling comes from the little 2"x2" vent? I assume that the "temp" adjustment is just an adjustable damper that modulates the air flow rate. Output seems pretty cold and pretty strong. We have been talking about the defrost system as the primary suspect here. 

1. Is that little vent the only thing that cools the fridge part??

2. At this time, is there any reason to not leave the refrig temp setting at max if I am not even close to freezing?

3. If the freezer is keeping consistently cold around 0 degF,  how can a defrost system issue affect only the refrigerator?

4. Why does it seem that the freezer temp adjustment towards colder seem to have no affect on tempurature. I see that at some point (at setting around 5 of 7) the compressor kicks on.

 

Good news, I just found a repair manual for a similar (as in almost identical) Maytag called a Technical Education Workbook for the 1998 Model G Refrigerator. I will try their specific instructions on the control panel removal and see if I make some headway. However, responding to my questions above would stll be a great help!! Thank YOU!

[Larbo]

Oh, the air coming out of the vent in the fridge is 2-3 degF.  That is about 8 degF warmer than the freezer. Normal?

 

[Vance R]

The freezer air mixes with the warmer air in the refrigerator to get the 38 or so degrees. Have to let the refrigerator running for awhile to get stable temps. There should be an air return back to the freezer some where in the refrigerator area.

[ECtoFix]

4 hours ago, Vance R said:

Not sure on how it works for posting picture in diy section.

I use this site to post pictures.  Just copy one of the codes it gives you after your upload:

IBB - Upload images

[Larbo]

Yes, two little rectangular return tubes in the rear corners.

Can you impart a little insight as to how a defrost issue can make the fridge warmer but not affect the freezer?

Also, I finally got the Control Panel off. Wow. What a pain!  Both temp controls must be pushed towards the center of the refrigerator. The kicker is that the air damper/fridge t-stat unit is attached to the control panel cover by snapping under and in between two tall arms (see pic). I wondered what the two rectangular holes in the panel cover were for and now I (we) know. You have to pull both arms backwards enough to release that unit and allow it to "stay behind" as you lower the cover. Also be sure to NOT rotate the gear on the t-stat unit and to put the cover back with both temp controls pushed to center... or mark the gear's position. Lastly, you have to be careful because two small, breakable tabs that secure the back of the cover to the fridge top have to go into the slots at just the right angle. After breaking one and glueing it back together, I did 2 things to help with the reinstallation. I filed a little off the edge of that tab to make it easier to get in and out. I also put a little non-oily silicone spray on some the more resistent rubbing surfaces like those tabs and some of the styrofoam interfaces.  Why they couldn't just put in 4 corner screws and just drop it straight down will remain a mystery for all eternity. 

So, the fridge temp is not just a damper control, it is also a t-stat. Hmmmm.

 

[Vance R]

2 hours ago, Larbo said:

Can you impart a little insight as to how a defrost issue can make the fridge warmer but not affect the freezer?

Low or no airflow through the evaporator. Freezer stays closer to temp. without airflow the refrigerator really suffers.

[Budget Appliance Repair]

@Larbo Your pictures aren't showing up - I'm pretty sure you need to make them public, (you can probably see them fine but not showing up for others - at least not for me).

So you are getting good air flow out the damper?  (If so then the damper should be open - it should close when the refrig sections gets cold enough to satisfy the damper temp control).

At this point I think it would be a good idea to pull the evaporator cover in the freezer section off after it has been running for a few hours and get an eye on the evaporator frost pattern just to make sure you're not low on Freon/R134a coolant.  At the same time you will be able to see if you have any ice blockage in the air return vents or frost blocking the evaporator.

[Larbo]

Hi William, thanks for your input!

Trying to get pics to work on this forum . I am trying to get into Acct Settings and it is asking for Google Authenticator. I cannot get this app to work. No wonder it has such low ratings. Too bad, pics are really helpful. No FAQs, no support, no options. Even the email option is not working. However, I digress.

I will try to pull of the freezer cover and see what I see. Damper has good flow. I have the fridge set on 7/7 so it is at max all the time (since temps are from 40 to upper 40's all the time now. Freezer is still (as always) -10 to +5 but usually -5 to 0.

I would add that after I had the unit off for 12 hours and ran the defrost shortly upon turning it back on ("as insurance"),  the fridge temp still did not get below 40. Just makes me think that it is not an ice issue.  Damper flow is good and I physically looked and operated the damper. The unit ran at 35 for many years (with middle temp settings) then suddently it jumped up 5-7 degrees. Thanks.